sapote | (no subject)

Entry tags:

dr_who

(no subject)

So today I watched *cough* an undisclosed amount of Doctor Who.

Let's start at the end: The Impossible Planet? The Satan Pit? You people knew a television show could be this good, and you did not tell me? Oh my god, I thought my head was going to explode. I jumped up and down. I did Paul Gross arms. Oh my GOD.

Also, did anyone notice how ridiculously hot the Torchwood rocket crew was? I was especially fond of Danny, in the face if not the persona. It's a shame they didn't get a spinoff. That would have been some pretty, pretty fanfiction.

Also, zomgers, seriously, I am about to burst from the awesomeness. That was ridiculous.

Also, re: Ten/Rose, I GIVE UP. Their love is pure! I love them! They love each other! They make me wibble. ::glances at short, short list of episodes left:: ::maintains state of perfect denial::

Moving back towards Age of Steel, I was relieved to see Mickey find a place, and get out of that unhealthy thing he and Rose had going on. It was nice to see the poor kid get some respect in the end, after all that pining.

There was a moment in Age of Steel that - well, there are two gestures or bits of body language in Doctor Who that seem to me kind of central to the Doctor / Rose relationship. First, starting in The End of the World, the hand-holding: I like that, symbolically, because it makes sense to me that the Doctor / Companion relationship is all about having someone to hold your hand while the sun explodes. Second, in Age of Steel, and I've seen it before: there's this hug Rose gives the Doctor when they're sure they're about to die, with this big grin on her face. It's the I wouldn't have missed it for the world hug, and it kills me. It is possible to imagine that Rose Tyler believes so much in the Doctor that "we're all about to die" isn't real to her, but I think that somewhere in Season 2 the penny drops, and she still hugs him like it's the best thing in the universe just to be in that place at that moment together.

Seriously, I usually watch shows with a fair amount of ironic detachment, and I don't really know what's gotten into me that this particular show is hitting me so hard. Maybe it's just that good, or maybe it's that I wholeheartedly, for once, like the hero. Maybe it's that it is kind of a kids' show, and not ironic, itself, at all. Whatever. It is bringing me some serious joy.

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

One of the things that I absolutely love best about Rose is how she seems to really enjoy everything that happens. She's not one of those who whines, or tries to play it safe, she actually gets giddy. Like with the werewolf, and her fun clothes in the Idiot's Lantern. I just love that she's not 'too cool' to get really excited. I mean, the stuff she sees is fabulous! It's fantastic (*mini sob*).

See, and I feel that there's an interesting other side to that: Rose is really reckless, and she isn't a good foil at all for that whole throw-self-into-space-void-just-to-see-what-happens thing he does. Like in 2x05, where she's all "I'm going to wander off into this parallel universe and meddle with the course of events!" and he's all "I like you way, way too much to argue."

So there's some complexity to it, in my preferred reading, but yes, whatever her reasons, Rose just throws herself into things, and it is awesome.

See, people keep telling me she's not a good foil for Ten, but I have to respectfully disagree. I feel that for Nine, who was kind of vulnerable, she very much got to be vulnerable with him and be all nurtury and a good listener and it was most important that she keep him, I guess I could say connected; she couldn't let him get hurt enough to really shut off.

Tenth Doctor is much more reckless and I think a corollary of that is that he's harder. And for all of his childish bounciness he seems a little jaded. In the second season, Rose really works as his sense of wonder. He loves her (whether romantically or not, read as you will) and when she gets excited and interested, so does he. So of course it's all 'I like you too much to argue' if he didn't, it's not that I think he'd help people less, I just think he'd look less. And I don't want to spoil you, but there is a little reticence to the Doctor when he's with Martha when it comes to the 'case'. He still does it, but there's this little pause before he does something.

I may possibly be blinded by the fact that I'm pathetically in love with her. Just possibly.

yes, that's true. Everything with Nine was a lot quieter. A lot of the Nine -> Ten transition stuff breaks my heart a little, because yes, Ten has got some bitterness to him, doesn't he?

I may possibly be blinded by the fact that I'm pathetically in love with her. Just possibly.

I want to say "anyone who isn't is DEAD INSIDE", but actually, I respect a wide variety of Rose Tyler opinions, so I will just say ME TOO, APPARENTLY and move on.

bitter? no, really? I think it might have been too subtle when he said 'I used to have so much mercy' or when he was REALLY going to let them both die if Cassandra didn't hop right quick out of Rose. He's got a ruthlessness to him that Nine didn't manage at his meanest (which I think was, 'I picked another stupid ape'). I respect the Rose opinions, but I think it's a little bit like I respect other religions, but I really don't believe them.

and I don't really like the ruthlessness, because it's not like there's a shortage of tv heroes who kill things, but I can see how he got there. sigh.

::may actually sign off soon, so comments may stop being so insta-::

Well, isn't it like 1am where you are? I think you're excused for sleeping.

I know, I didn't really need the extra ruthlessness. I mean, I have Supernatural (everything Dean does when it comes to Sam)and Firefly with Captain Mal. I guess I freaked out the most at tenth doctor when he used the satsuma on the Sycorax. I went all 'Nine would never have done that!' and then tried to convince myself to give him more chances.

Yes. Re: satsuma, I did not like that. And I am giving him more chances, and I rather like him, but sometimes it is just a question of slightly less horrible-"heroic"-behavior-handwaving than other shows. Sigh. Still, he tries. Sometimes.

At least there haven't been (to my recollection) a lot of situations where Rose has been the Feminine Voice of Mercy. I hate it when they (they!) make the girl stay the hero's hand with her tender feelings. That is probably my most-hated thing about Elizabeth from SGA.

Don't even talk to me about Elizabeth. I watch her (like in the Return I where she locks herself in her apartment and seems to do nothing but cry and eat ice cream for a month) and I think, 'this is the woman who negotiated peace treaties in Africa and commands Marines? You must be joking.' This is why I am grateful every day for fanfic, the beautiful thing that makes everything better.

I love the fact that Rose doesn't do that. But there's a whole complicated thing off of that that I don't want to get into while I am as sleep deprived as I am.

As far as the parallel universe flouncing thing, it occurs to me that Nine probably would have been all over exploring, so it wouldn't have seemed like Rose was being weird. It's a difference in Doctor thing again. I always take comfort in the fact that he will never be as crazy as Tom Baker. Fourth Doctor is his own benchmark.

true. We will have to have the female character doom!thread some other time, because I swear I am signing off now, really. (I was canning jam at a friend's for most of the evening, and my bloodstream is still solid sugar. It has mostly worn off. I might sleep sometime this month.)

I definitely did feel that the the push-pull of their relationship was changing, and that less-adventurous Doctor idea makes sense. My first reading of it was that for whatever reason - new Doctor, or just known each other for longer - he's treating Rose more as an equal now. So instead of him just pulling her along, when she pulls, he goes. I rather like that idea.

The thing is, I think these characters are actually well-drawn enough that we're not being completely insane trying to read these things into them. But that could be the fanbrain talking.

Alright. You sleep too! It's not that much earlier there.

You seem to feel how I felt about 7th doctor and Ace. (although they weren't in love ...) It's making me nostalgic ... *sighs*

::cannot stop boggling at the canon, so much canon::
really, seriously, is it all this awesome? I'm willing to accept that the special effects sucked for the first half-dozen Doctors.

Well, some of it *is* 40 years old ... *g*

I particulary am fond of 5 (Peter Davison) and 7 (Sylvester McCoy - he is it as far as I'm concerned). 7 & Ace were awesome - she was a teenager with authority issues who loved to blow things up and say "Ace!". They had *such* a fantastic relationship. You really should try to catch some of each doctor. I don't know about over there, but here you can rent and buy DVDS from each doctor.

And honestly? The special effects sucked until 8. But it doesn't matter :-)

I have the feeling that Australia has regular contact with the BBC in many capacities? Here, not so much. tvlinks.co.uk is slowly getting more classic Doctor, though, and since that's where I watch most of my tv nowadays, I'm hoping to catch some of it as it appears. Ace sounds awesome.

Yeah, we've had Doctor Who airing since almost the same time as England. I grew up on a steady diet of British teev. I always felt bad for American children, to be deprived of the experience of growing up with Doctor Who. We had all the novelisations of the early shows, too, in case we missed an episode.

Ace was frickin' awesome. She was the first real companion who was able to really help herself, and not spend a lot of time yelling "Doctor!" We were gutted when the show was cancelled after one season of 7. It lived on in the "new adventures" books & audios, some of which were good, but partway through the writers "reinvented" Ace's future and wrote her as a battle-scarred veteran in a rubber catsuit. At this point I started throwing the books under passing buses. I wish I could sit you down right now and show you "Rememberance of the Daleks", the 25th anniversary episode. I'd have to explain all the canon-dependent references, though, so it might not be as enjoyable for you as for me!

hee, people trying to explain their huge sf canon mid-episode is usually awesome, if confusing. And yes, five minutes on wikipedia and I've already seen the rubber catsuit. Why, why must there always be a catsuit in the end?

No, seriously, feel sorry for us. No Dalek jokes! Not ever! British people would go "Exterminate! Exterminate!" and we'd just stare at them like they'd sprouted extra heads.

Why, why must there always be a catsuit in the end?

sing it, sister.

here's a journal entry of mine you probably haven't seen - it pre-dates our friending, i think...

http://rilestar.livejournal.com/17395.html

omg ::very much admires your satchel::

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only